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#1 prmurat

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Posted 16 March 2011 - 08:37 PM

Hello I am new here and have a question...
I was the unlucky victim of a mc accident in Oct 09 and I had the final Dr diagnostic this week: my right arm is screwed! The radial nerve is not growing back so no deltoid, triceps and very little hand extenders. With a collection of 21 bikes and my life on motorcycles it's tough to swallow. I think I could ride small bikes but touring on big barges is over. I am seriously thinking of the RT as it seems perfect for me! My main concern is the very small movement I have to open and close the throttle; is it possible to replace the "fly by wire throttle tube" by a thumb/trigger a la ATV/snowmobile?
Thanks
Philippe

#2 Nancy'sToy

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Posted 16 March 2011 - 10:14 PM

Very sorry to hear of your situation. With 25 bikes, I can relate, and I would be devastated. As far as I know, nobody has come up with an alternate throttle for the RT as yet. You would be the first. There are significant challenges to overcome. The signals sent to the throttle positioner and ECM are strictly digital, via the CanBus, so somehow you would have to convert your analog cable signal to a compatible digital output. If there is a way to accomplish it, it is way beyond my abilities. I wish you luck in your quest.

Please also be aware that the Spyder requires a certain amount of upper body movement , strength, and agility. This is especially true in avoidance maneuvers. You do not countersteer a Spyder, your steer it...with a great deal of arm movement. It also does not steer as much by shifting your weight as a soft-tired ATV will. You will have to be sure that a Spyder is within your physical capabilities. If you can't arrange a demo ride, at least sit on one at the dealer, and put it through the motions. Again, I wish you the best outcome in your research.
-Scotty

#3 PatandSandi

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Posted 16 March 2011 - 11:58 PM

What Scotty said and just to add for speculation, once the upper body strength and mobility question is settled, what about an adaptation or something like a throttle rocker. You know, the paddle shaped things that enable you to use your wrist to control or at least position the throttle. Just a thought.

Patrick

#4 RattiganRoger

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Posted 17 March 2011 - 07:27 AM

is it possible to replace the "fly by wire throttle tube" by a thumb/trigger a la ATV/snowmobile?


There's actually no magic involved in the throttle position sensor.
The sensor is directly wired into the ECM and not on the CanBus.

The sensor uses two Hall Effect sensors and is fairly straightforward from an electronics standpoint.
The real challenge as I see it would be to mechanically connect the sensors to an alternate setup.

#5 Nancy'sToy

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Posted 17 March 2011 - 08:01 AM

There's actually no magic involved in the throttle position sensor.
The sensor is directly wired into the ECM and not on the CanBus.

The sensor uses two Hall Effect sensors and is fairly straightforward from an electronics standpoint.
The real challenge as I see it would be to mechanically connect the sensors to an alternate setup.

:D That's a whole lot easier for an electrical engineer to say than a lowly biologist working as an environmental engineer (and old-school mechanic). :D

Seriously, there seems to be a real need here...and a niche for someone with brains and ability to come up with a viable solution. One of the Spyder's greatest assets is it's capabilities to serve people who cannot or would not otherwise ride. The aftermarket has expanded that capability, as have individual modifications. I'm sure this makes the BRP lawyers very nervous, but I think it is a good thing. I hope this particular problem can be resolved satisfactorily.
-Scotty

#6 IWN2RYD

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Posted 17 March 2011 - 08:48 AM

Cool info in the subject... My link

I will make a few calls today and see what I can find... May end up being nothing, but like Scotty is mentioning above, this has come up a lot this year.

I wonder... Did these engines also ise the fly by wire in the Aprilla setup or had they been mechanical. Because my shade tree brain cell in going hmmmm... If it was mechanical, I wonder if by simply replacing the throttle body would do the trick... :TgC_emoticon142:

I know for that some company had converted the fly by wire at the human point of connection to mechanical. Here is proof on a welder. It is a tube like throttle that you can spin the knob to hold an RPM... Not the item we need right now, just being offered as a ray of hope... My link
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#7 RattiganRoger

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Posted 17 March 2011 - 09:44 AM

Cool info in the subject... The throttle pedal has two potentiometers attached to it, achieving the accuracy required from the pedal’s movement. The photograph on the left shows the throttle pedal assembly with the potentiometers attached to the side. The resistance ‘felt’ when the pedal is depressed is designed to give the same feel as a conventional throttle. The throttle pedal, in this instance, has 6 electrical connections.


I think eliminating the fly by wire would be a real rat's nest better left untouched.
Everything from Limp Home, cruise control to cold starting would be affected. The ECM controls just about every aspect of the engine by playing with the throttle body signals.

The fly by wire in the link uses potentiometers (variable resistors) to sense the throttle position and this would be extremely easy to rebuild.

The Spyder uses Hall effect sensors.
DISCLAIMER:I have NOT verified the following through actual measurement or inspection and can't do so right now due to marital bliss concerns if I tear the da*n thing apart one more time.

I think the throttle position is determined by the ECM by measuring the phase difference between the two sensors using some form of PLL (phase lock loop).

Not a lot to go on and while I whole heartedly agree that there is a need, it's something that careful legal considerations must be made before producing some alternative.

#8 prmurat

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Posted 17 March 2011 - 01:23 PM

Thanks guys for the input... I guess I have to research more and more on the "fly by wire" system! Maybe some geeky friends in Silicon Valley will help! I am working daily on my "simulator" but its tough with only 15 degrees of wrist range!
Posted Image

Philippe

#9 prmurat

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Posted 17 March 2011 - 01:50 PM

Sorry to take some band space again... but I seems to remember that the RS-S has a cable for throttle??, I could change the throttle and with the huge price difference I could maybe customize the RS-S (Corbin luggages, I have already a couple of Garmins, can live without music, taller windshield...and I can keep the real gearbox!).
Philippe
PS: anyone needs a 103CU Electra Glide, 09 Vmax or RGS Laverda... I have to pay my soon to come Spyder :riding:

#10 Nancy'sToy

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Posted 17 March 2011 - 05:35 PM

Sorry to take some band space again... but I seems to remember that the RS-S has a cable for throttle??, I could change the throttle and with the huge price difference I could maybe customize the RS-S (Corbin luggages, I have already a couple of Garmins, can live without music, taller windshield...and I can keep the real gearbox!).
Philippe
PS: anyone needs a 103CU Electra Glide, 09 Vmax or RGS Laverda... I have to pay my soon to come Spyder :riding:

The RS was introduced as a "sport-touring" model, although it is obviously something more like "sport-touring". Aftermarket bags are available from Givi and Corbin, and possibly others, and BRP sells a version of the Givi saddlebags with a nifty, removable mounting rack. There are also aftermarket rear racks that will mount a Givi, or other, topcase. You can get taller, (manually) adjustable windshields, too. Different seats are available from BRP and several aftermarket and custom sources. It would certainly be easier to modify an RS or RS-S to meet your needs. There are a lot more of them available used, too. This is a good option.
-Scotty

#11 prmurat

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Posted 03 April 2011 - 11:42 AM

Went yesterday to test ride one... Interesting! I love the geek aspect with all the computers/ gadgets/ remote openings... Have to remember to upshift without cutting the throttle, same when downshifting as the "blip throttle" is automatic.... Great brake (s) . As any newbie I guess it takes time to get used to the turns.... Will not take it on Tioga pass on the 1st outing.
Well.... I just have to sell a few bikes and choose the color of my new RT...
Philippe

#12 Whinney

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Posted 12 April 2011 - 09:40 AM

Hi,
Just had to put in my 2 cents and hope I donot offend anyone with my response because that is not my objective - my objective is to give you some major encouragement and I hope I do that.

I am very new here - just started to learn how to ride motorcycles last July on a triked out Yamaha at 58 year of age. Now I have a Spyder RT and have put about 400 miles on it since March in NY. Am very sorry to hear that you had a very debilating accident. However, would like to encourage you a little. My man who is 56 today has been pretty seriously handicapped for a good part of his life. His whole right side is handicapped to the point where it's pretty obvious in the way he walks and the use of his whole right side. He is 56 today and is still riding 2 wheel bikes. I have been trying to get him on 3 wheels to make me feel better, but it's hard when you are dealing with male egos. He has very limited use of his left arm and hand, but can still grip the throttle enough to get his bike to go - not sure how he does this. He has about 60% use of his entire body, never slows the man down and no one not even his family remembers he is handicapped, which ticks me off a lot. While I am typing this I am thinking myself - How does he do it really??? Still ride on 2 wheels and balance has to be a major issue for him too.

Now a word on the RT, don't know about the sport model, but my RT has a very touchy throttle and the steering is very light - doesn't take much at all to make it go, so you might be OK just the way you are once you recover. I had a little trouble getting used to the very light steering and I find myself all the time speeding because of the light throttle. Hope I don't get a ticket!!!

Good Luck and if you want to talk more that would be OK with me. Happy Riding Everyone!!

And as I said - Hope I didn't offend anyone with my story. Thank You.

#13 hook86

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Posted 06 April 2013 - 08:21 PM

I have bought a 2012 RTS SE-5. I am now wanting to move the throttle to the left hand because i lost my right arm in a mill accident 26 years ago. My current ride i bought  after my aciddent is a 1977 CB 750A Hondamatic that i converted over . Was easy because it is a cable system. My dealer is not to excited about doing the conversion because of the liability asspect, can not say i blame them. So am looking for any info on doling this myself if i have to . Want to continue riding but am getting kinda old (56). Any help would be great.


Edited by hook86, 06 April 2013 - 08:22 PM.




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